One other thing I was thinking, was about the asking- one of the reason's the ex leper got what he wanted was he asked (more importantly, he asked the right man). In the Magician's Nephew, Digory and Polly are on a journey with Fledge (a flying horse). There is plenty of grass for Fledge to eat where they stop, but no food for the children,
“Well, I do think someone might have arranged about our meals,” said Digory.
“I'm sure Aslan would have, if you'd asked him,” said Fledge.
“Wouldn't he know without being asked?” said Polly.
“I've no doubt he would,” said the Horse (still with his mouth full). “But I've a sort of idea he likes to be asked.”
A bit further on, something that relates to misdirected desire,
“Child,” he replied, “that is why all the rest are now a horror to her. That is what happens to those who pluck and eat fruits at the wrong time and in the wrong way. The fruit is good, but they loathe it ever after.”
“Oh I see,” said Polly. “And I suppose because she took it in the wrong way it won't work for her. I mean it won't make her always young and all that?
“Alas,” said Aslan, shaking his head. “It will. Things always work according to their nature. She has won her heart's desire; she has unwearying strength and endless days like a goddess. But length of days with a evil heart is only length of misery and already she begins to know it. All get what they want; they do not always like it.”
Surely, it wasn't just the actions of this one man that meant that Jesus could no longer go into a town openly, but stayed out in the country; and people came to him from every quarter. He would have been stirring massive curiosity by many of the things he was doing and saying...
When it says stayed out in the country- does that mean he was camping out there too? How did the people know where he was? Word of mouth I suppose.- the country is eremois- lonely, deserted, wild places. - the crowds found him where he was anyway- so what was the issue with the towns- Is he trying to teach the disciples at this stage? Was is so ballistic that they got no time to themselves at all? - that seems likely -
Sunday, October 25, 2009
Thankfulness
A man with leprosy- an illness which perhaps means it not as hard for him as many to overcome that self dignity thing- on his knees before Jesus, with a statement of faith and hope- but perhaps not necessarily what Barclay would call Christian hope. Or maybe it was- I wonder how much this man knew of Jesus – had he seen him in action in other places- what had he noticed about his character? He would have known Jesus had healed other people- was it “well this is worth a punt?” a man on his knees doesn't really feel like that- more this disease has stripped me of nearly everything and in desperation with a thin sliver of hope- I will ask this man if he can heal me of this blight. Can only wonder- the story puts in place a few parameters – we know of this man's condition- and we know he was willing enough to fall at someone's feet and beg (and perhaps that willingness to ask does tell us a bit) but we don't particularly know what kind of man he was. It would seem there are some who suffer amazing things with incredible grace (Di Tyson from what I know- Pete Vol's mum from his descriptions, where something very limiting does not mean they give way to self centredness or become defined perhaps by the illness. There are many others who (understandably) do not handle such a situation well. This man's immediate response seems exuberant as well as disobedient (seems fairly understandable to a degree) He tells others what happened to him – lets them know it was Jesus who affected the change- there seems to be at least some kind of gratefulness there- but on the whole it does not seem that grateful or classy to me. - You have just been cured of an illness which meant you could be part of normal human society- (it could have been years or decades), and the man who you thought could cure you has- and he tells you not to tell anyone but to go and do a practical thing, get the official nod to recognise what I have just done here, so that you may enter back into society. Jesus gives him a strong warning – comes from embrimesamenos (used classically to denote 'scarce controlled animal fury' pg 118 France) It would seem from what France writes that normally the object of this word would be the object of strong disapproval- but because there doesn't seem a reason for Jesus to be doing that here, it is translated 'strictly charged' rather than scolded or worse. Whatever- It seems there should be no trouble for the man clearly picking up Jesus drift. I feel like the least I could do in a similar situation, was to respect the wishes of the man who had just given me my heart's desire. There are strings attached- and they are not burdensome strings- but the man does the exact opposite of what Jesus asked him.
Perhaps this gives us more insight into the man than what I was thinking- He got what he wanted from Jesus- then failed to respect him- I wonder if he ever 'came back' became really healed- understood what had happened to him as a 'sign' as John would put it, repented of what he had done.
I suppose it is possible- though it doesn't bode well, if you miss it in such a situation as this. Who knows – an instance of Aslan telling us not to worry- no one is ever told what would have happened, or that is someone else's story.
Thankfulness- calls forth some sort of response- and I think a right thankfulness draws us away from ourself to want to honour or praise or be grateful to someone or something else. Perhaps any other kind of thankfulness is not really that thankful- what would you call the ex lepers response then? He's telling everyone about it- obviously glad about what's happened- glad but not thankful?...
Hasn't got the grateful part- thankfulness with no grace. I suppose you can rejoice in something that is evil... but perhaps even there- though there may have been thankfulness there at the time- I think that would diminish- don't think you can be thankful for evil for eternity- if it's not good it becomes a horror- hold onto it and that leads to death- what Lewis talks about when he says in the end everybody gets what they want.
It was a rainy day yesterday- cleaning the house- didn't get as far as I wanted- watched God's must be crazy 2- poor cousin to it's predecessor- always a bad feeling, thinking you've just wasted 2 hours of your life watching a bad or dumb movie, a few other negative thought trains- Anyway- thankfulness out the window- forgive me please, and help me to see.
Perhaps this gives us more insight into the man than what I was thinking- He got what he wanted from Jesus- then failed to respect him- I wonder if he ever 'came back' became really healed- understood what had happened to him as a 'sign' as John would put it, repented of what he had done.
I suppose it is possible- though it doesn't bode well, if you miss it in such a situation as this. Who knows – an instance of Aslan telling us not to worry- no one is ever told what would have happened, or that is someone else's story.
Thankfulness- calls forth some sort of response- and I think a right thankfulness draws us away from ourself to want to honour or praise or be grateful to someone or something else. Perhaps any other kind of thankfulness is not really that thankful- what would you call the ex lepers response then? He's telling everyone about it- obviously glad about what's happened- glad but not thankful?...
Hasn't got the grateful part- thankfulness with no grace. I suppose you can rejoice in something that is evil... but perhaps even there- though there may have been thankfulness there at the time- I think that would diminish- don't think you can be thankful for evil for eternity- if it's not good it becomes a horror- hold onto it and that leads to death- what Lewis talks about when he says in the end everybody gets what they want.
It was a rainy day yesterday- cleaning the house- didn't get as far as I wanted- watched God's must be crazy 2- poor cousin to it's predecessor- always a bad feeling, thinking you've just wasted 2 hours of your life watching a bad or dumb movie, a few other negative thought trains- Anyway- thankfulness out the window- forgive me please, and help me to see.
Preaching and demonic extradition
Jesus travels throughout Galilee, preaching in their synagogues and driving out demons- a summary of a number of months I imagine- And these are the two elements he puts in of the time- preaching in Synagogues and driving out demons (does John have many demons being driven out?) It sounds like quite a few demons got driven out- seems like a fairly widespread ailment- once again wonder how widespread today- should I be thinking about how to drive them out? I suppose there's more than just 'exorcism' that drives them out- when the kingdom comes into a place it has not particularly been before. Perhaps Jesus would like us to get a hold of this first- how do you love your neighbour, say no to temptation, learn obedience and endurance- would seem that running around casting out demons is not for the immature- “Jesus I know, and I know about Paul, but who are you? then they get a beating and run out naked and bleeding..
(Is this another case of demonic honesty not out of any desire to be honest, but in this case actually stating truth- Jesus I know- have had experience of him- seen him in all his glory- though this is some sort of horror like Jadis in the Magicians Nephew after she has eaten the apple- And whatever I think of him I know he is powerful, I know about Paul- he's been causing no end of trouble- trying to thwart what he's up to- but you- you have no idea what you are doing- or what you are up against- and in this case no idea of the one whose name you are carrying out these casting outs) – interestingly it seems they had had success before meeting with this demon- what does that mean?
Preaching in Synagogues- Israel such an interesting nation with this amazing heritage- Jesus could sound chords here in a way not possible in other countries- deeper, richer, with more complexities. Not many people seemed to get the whole score or even a large chunk of it in their heads at once- but it was there to be appreciated and understood- ah there's the Moses chord, ah was that an unmistakable messiah note. Jesus is not coming from the outside- what he brings is not entirely new, he is no alien with a bright light- but a Jewish man grown in Jewish soil... a man brought up to know appreciate the goodness and stoutness of the old wine of the Jews- had taken it in deeply- brings a new wine- more full bodied and zesty than the old- but it's still from the same vineyard- as Paul points out- the same stock; the same roots.
(Is this another case of demonic honesty not out of any desire to be honest, but in this case actually stating truth- Jesus I know- have had experience of him- seen him in all his glory- though this is some sort of horror like Jadis in the Magicians Nephew after she has eaten the apple- And whatever I think of him I know he is powerful, I know about Paul- he's been causing no end of trouble- trying to thwart what he's up to- but you- you have no idea what you are doing- or what you are up against- and in this case no idea of the one whose name you are carrying out these casting outs) – interestingly it seems they had had success before meeting with this demon- what does that mean?
Preaching in Synagogues- Israel such an interesting nation with this amazing heritage- Jesus could sound chords here in a way not possible in other countries- deeper, richer, with more complexities. Not many people seemed to get the whole score or even a large chunk of it in their heads at once- but it was there to be appreciated and understood- ah there's the Moses chord, ah was that an unmistakable messiah note. Jesus is not coming from the outside- what he brings is not entirely new, he is no alien with a bright light- but a Jewish man grown in Jewish soil... a man brought up to know appreciate the goodness and stoutness of the old wine of the Jews- had taken it in deeply- brings a new wine- more full bodied and zesty than the old- but it's still from the same vineyard- as Paul points out- the same stock; the same roots.
For this is what I came out to do
and simon and those with him? hunted him down – seek out, in a good sense- I wonder here if the reason we get Simon and his companions hunting for him, is because this is Peter's remembrance, with Mark writing that down... So how Mark would have heard the story (probably many times..) would be – I or we- got up and noticed Jesus was missing so I went out with the others to seek him out.
They come to Jesus with news (charming news if you were an introvert) everyone is looking for you- so they weren't the only ones out hunting- quite a buzz in the town.
Let us go to the neighbouring towns, so that I may proclaim the message there also; for that is what I came out to do.” eis touto gar exelthon- for this purpose I came out- exelthon is interesting- is that coming from Nazareth- would seem to make sense.
Jesus has a very clear objective in mind- he doesn't overly try to persuade people- or provide too much hand holding- at various times he actually forces the issue- decide now- are you with me or not. - What does that mean for evangelism? I felt slightly uncomfortable at the recent meeting for a camp I'll be a leader at for kids from troubled backgrounds- they give them a really good experience- have a couple of talks, then an altar call type of thing at the end (the gospel talk calling for a response) they are years 6 to 8 kids. I'm not sure if that's quite right- it doesn't give them a lot of time to really digest what this is about- they are coming from hard places- they are still formulating all sorts of things- is there a slight hysteria here to get people into the kingdom? Jesus does however make this sort of need for decision very clear to people- makes it clear then leaves it to them...
They said half the girls on the last camp made 'decsions'- I wonder how much they made them? and in 10 years time how many will have made the decision- it seems like a fairly shallow (flippant?) way to go about informing people of such a serious undertaking- joyful- all pervading...
They come to Jesus with news (charming news if you were an introvert) everyone is looking for you- so they weren't the only ones out hunting- quite a buzz in the town.
Let us go to the neighbouring towns, so that I may proclaim the message there also; for that is what I came out to do.” eis touto gar exelthon- for this purpose I came out- exelthon is interesting- is that coming from Nazareth- would seem to make sense.
Jesus has a very clear objective in mind- he doesn't overly try to persuade people- or provide too much hand holding- at various times he actually forces the issue- decide now- are you with me or not. - What does that mean for evangelism? I felt slightly uncomfortable at the recent meeting for a camp I'll be a leader at for kids from troubled backgrounds- they give them a really good experience- have a couple of talks, then an altar call type of thing at the end (the gospel talk calling for a response) they are years 6 to 8 kids. I'm not sure if that's quite right- it doesn't give them a lot of time to really digest what this is about- they are coming from hard places- they are still formulating all sorts of things- is there a slight hysteria here to get people into the kingdom? Jesus does however make this sort of need for decision very clear to people- makes it clear then leaves it to them...
They said half the girls on the last camp made 'decsions'- I wonder how much they made them? and in 10 years time how many will have made the decision- it seems like a fairly shallow (flippant?) way to go about informing people of such a serious undertaking- joyful- all pervading...
Under Galilean stars
Coming back to this the next day- I had another thought with this at the time- Jesus relationship with the Father does not happen in a vacuum- it is an expansion of what has come before- I don't know how this works- but I assume a fair bit (perhaps most) of Jesus knowledge here was appropriated the same way we appropriate this knowledge. He would have been soaked in the Hebrew scriptures, spent time under galilean stars communing with the Father- pondering things at the workbench (I feel what limits this train of thought a little is Luke's story when he was 12- did you not know I had to be in my Father's house?) - Still, did a certain amount of revelation have to happen before the son of God could come as a man (the old testament)- so that he could tap into that (as men do- but in this case with an unsullied vision)...
Tuesday, October 20, 2009
Early morning
and prwi early in the morning while it was still very dark- went out to a deserted place and prayed.
Even though just taken 8 pages to muse on this- still close to the beginning. We're hearing what Jesus is up to in this public undertaking- people have been amazed at his authority- the demons have quailed and obeyed, sick people have been cured. he's based at Capernaum at the moment- and now he's off praying before anyone else is up- I think that is significant- a discipline (necessity?) that I struggle with- but if you want to enjoy deep communion with the father- walk in step- follow strongly...
It's not a desert retreat (I suppose he's had one of those of sorts)- not sitting crosslegged on a mountain contemplating- immediately followed by action, perhaps even an expansion or next stage of the mission- out into Galilee- obedience and maybe just being, has to lead into action at some point- a pharasaical faith cops his fury. Not action for the sake of it however- somehow springing from early morning time with the father- a setting of priorities- listening for what these priorities are.. How did this time go? We don't have much to go on- Jesus outburst when the 70 return “At that same hour Jesus rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, “I thankyou, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and intelligent and have revealed them to infants; yes, father for such was your gracious will- then he moves on to saying something about his relationship with the father and still I imagine with great joy turns to the disciples and tells them how big and good it is what they have been let in on. Abba Father... Why have you forsaken me? Pray like this...our father. TR Glover suggests we should perhaps go no further in this prayer until we've got some idea of Jesus conception here- let his close knowledge of the Father ground our own.
Even with the scant information we have can probably work out a lot. There's reverence- Jesus knows the father- and if you do I imagine you are not glib- perhaps something in this with the demon's repsonse- the holy one of god (I think at the crucifixion that has gone- and there's jeering and belittling, but they here may be still held by the knowledge of Jesus person- may hate it and wish it wasn't – but it illicits a certain (high) level of respect.
Mixed with the reverence- closeness and the freedom to call the lord of heaven and earth, dad. There's honesty too- that functions with the reverence- my God, my God why have you forsaken me- right now I cannot see the goodness? of this present situation – but when you combine that with psalm 22- with the despair, trust in his goodness.
Even though just taken 8 pages to muse on this- still close to the beginning. We're hearing what Jesus is up to in this public undertaking- people have been amazed at his authority- the demons have quailed and obeyed, sick people have been cured. he's based at Capernaum at the moment- and now he's off praying before anyone else is up- I think that is significant- a discipline (necessity?) that I struggle with- but if you want to enjoy deep communion with the father- walk in step- follow strongly...
It's not a desert retreat (I suppose he's had one of those of sorts)- not sitting crosslegged on a mountain contemplating- immediately followed by action, perhaps even an expansion or next stage of the mission- out into Galilee- obedience and maybe just being, has to lead into action at some point- a pharasaical faith cops his fury. Not action for the sake of it however- somehow springing from early morning time with the father- a setting of priorities- listening for what these priorities are.. How did this time go? We don't have much to go on- Jesus outburst when the 70 return “At that same hour Jesus rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, “I thankyou, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and intelligent and have revealed them to infants; yes, father for such was your gracious will- then he moves on to saying something about his relationship with the father and still I imagine with great joy turns to the disciples and tells them how big and good it is what they have been let in on. Abba Father... Why have you forsaken me? Pray like this...our father. TR Glover suggests we should perhaps go no further in this prayer until we've got some idea of Jesus conception here- let his close knowledge of the Father ground our own.
Even with the scant information we have can probably work out a lot. There's reverence- Jesus knows the father- and if you do I imagine you are not glib- perhaps something in this with the demon's repsonse- the holy one of god (I think at the crucifixion that has gone- and there's jeering and belittling, but they here may be still held by the knowledge of Jesus person- may hate it and wish it wasn't – but it illicits a certain (high) level of respect.
Mixed with the reverence- closeness and the freedom to call the lord of heaven and earth, dad. There's honesty too- that functions with the reverence- my God, my God why have you forsaken me- right now I cannot see the goodness? of this present situation – but when you combine that with psalm 22- with the despair, trust in his goodness.
Capernaum
Capernaum- how long had it existed? not much must have approached this in its whole history. When Mark says the whole city – I bet it does mean a very large percentage of the town- And they see amazing things- and things that must be setting off many resonances and disonances in their heads. There is such a heritage with the Jews- perhaps no other people have had such a carefully preserved and 'normed' heritage – as Bruggeman says (or is it Berger) a case of universe maintenance where each generation seeks to tilt the world so the next generation holds that view of the world as well (stakes particularly high in the Jews case- and they had some powerful agents involved in the world tilting.
This must have been discussed here for years- Peter, Andrew, James and John- they were Capernaum boys- what was the population (Capernaum the nearest village to the river Jordan on the NW shores of the Sea of Galilee) Don't have anything readily available to tell me 5000?* Don't imagine it was much bigger- a size where these men would have been known or known of by much of the town- and they take up with this strange rabbi who does things unlike other rabbis of the day.
What was the effect over the years in this place? “And you Capernaum will you be exalted to heaven? No, you will be brought down to Hades. For if the deeds of power had been done in you have been done in Sodom, it would have remained until this day. But I tell you that on the day of judgement it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom than for you.”
*Wiki answers - that Charlesworth reckons the population was between 600 and 1200.
Another site says its not known how large Capernaum was – but its thought to be under 2000.
From Archeology and the Galilean Jesus- he looks like he goes into it a fair bit- based on a likely size between 6 and 10 hectares – he says between 600 to 1500- also says that Nazareth probably fewer than 400 inhabitants, “Capernaum would have been viewed as one of the larger villages.” (p152). Reckons that Sephoris and Tiberias between 8000 and 12000.
On the whole they mustn't have taken the risk- surely when these things were happening there were many who actually thrilled with them- they saw people they knew and love being healed, family members cured of demon possession (how wide spread was it? how widespread is it? ) Was Jesus career followed with interest? Had they already 'turned' before his crucifixion? (had John 6.66 moments- or perhaps actually been there? Does the thrilling lead to an openess or an oportunity to take a risk of faith – to go along with this man for a bit and see where it leads- because there is much here that adds up? but they on the whole only do this in a very superficial australian idol type of way... Is someone like me- who has never seen anything like this- one of the one who condemns them? “God's blessing on people who don't see, and yet believe!” What does Jesus call them -you faithless generation – (Mk 9:19 you faithless generation, how much longer must I be among you? How much longer must I put up with you?)
- Strong words- strong feeling. Is this the most negative thing Jesus has to say about the people he loves and has come to save? Without faith it is impossible to please God...
O you of little faith... Abraham held up as an example of faith- because unlike Capernaum, he knew and had experienced little- but on hearing a 'voice' shifted to another world 1200 kms? from Ur to Canaan- and his knowledge grew through obediance- the willingness to take the risk on this God- and through that he found him faithful.
How much of a partnership was it between the demons and those at Capernaum that rejected Jesus?
Does the no in one direction open you up for a yes in another? Can the demons work with this sort of vacillation? how much can they encourage it?
It would seem that they had a front opened up in Capernaum- and suffered some big setbacks – as the country saw a great light- but that in this case they were able to consolidate- but perhaps the attitude of the people comes first?
And Jesus was amazed at their lack of faith and couldn't do many miracles there...
This must have been discussed here for years- Peter, Andrew, James and John- they were Capernaum boys- what was the population (Capernaum the nearest village to the river Jordan on the NW shores of the Sea of Galilee) Don't have anything readily available to tell me 5000?* Don't imagine it was much bigger- a size where these men would have been known or known of by much of the town- and they take up with this strange rabbi who does things unlike other rabbis of the day.
What was the effect over the years in this place? “And you Capernaum will you be exalted to heaven? No, you will be brought down to Hades. For if the deeds of power had been done in you have been done in Sodom, it would have remained until this day. But I tell you that on the day of judgement it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom than for you.”
*Wiki answers - that Charlesworth reckons the population was between 600 and 1200.
Another site says its not known how large Capernaum was – but its thought to be under 2000.
From Archeology and the Galilean Jesus- he looks like he goes into it a fair bit- based on a likely size between 6 and 10 hectares – he says between 600 to 1500- also says that Nazareth probably fewer than 400 inhabitants, “Capernaum would have been viewed as one of the larger villages.” (p152). Reckons that Sephoris and Tiberias between 8000 and 12000.
On the whole they mustn't have taken the risk- surely when these things were happening there were many who actually thrilled with them- they saw people they knew and love being healed, family members cured of demon possession (how wide spread was it? how widespread is it? ) Was Jesus career followed with interest? Had they already 'turned' before his crucifixion? (had John 6.66 moments- or perhaps actually been there? Does the thrilling lead to an openess or an oportunity to take a risk of faith – to go along with this man for a bit and see where it leads- because there is much here that adds up? but they on the whole only do this in a very superficial australian idol type of way... Is someone like me- who has never seen anything like this- one of the one who condemns them? “God's blessing on people who don't see, and yet believe!” What does Jesus call them -you faithless generation – (Mk 9:19 you faithless generation, how much longer must I be among you? How much longer must I put up with you?)
- Strong words- strong feeling. Is this the most negative thing Jesus has to say about the people he loves and has come to save? Without faith it is impossible to please God...
O you of little faith... Abraham held up as an example of faith- because unlike Capernaum, he knew and had experienced little- but on hearing a 'voice' shifted to another world 1200 kms? from Ur to Canaan- and his knowledge grew through obediance- the willingness to take the risk on this God- and through that he found him faithful.
How much of a partnership was it between the demons and those at Capernaum that rejected Jesus?
Does the no in one direction open you up for a yes in another? Can the demons work with this sort of vacillation? how much can they encourage it?
It would seem that they had a front opened up in Capernaum- and suffered some big setbacks – as the country saw a great light- but that in this case they were able to consolidate- but perhaps the attitude of the people comes first?
And Jesus was amazed at their lack of faith and couldn't do many miracles there...
Monday, October 19, 2009
Whole city at your door
When evening came, that evening, when the sun had set- after sunset, - an interesting they- the people, the crowd- How soon after the event at the synagogue was this? It sounds like a big crowd- was that a result of Jesus telling the spirit to come out of the man earlier?
and the whole city was gathered around the door- polis is the word for city here- perhaps Capernaum was between a kwme (village) and a polis- in the NIV polis is translated city 86 times, town 51 and village once. Seems like a pretty big event in Capernaum- again told with a minimum of fuss- this is the town you have grown up in – you've never seen anything like this before- old bert who's been sick for 40 years has just been healed- the butcher who never shows much emotion is looking on incredulously- its all outside the door of your house. But Mark has already used amazed and astounded for the crowds reaction – don't need to dither here any more.
and he would not permit the demons to speak- because they knew him.
Must have been causing a ruckus in the spiritual realm- there's demons being turfed out in a way they mustn't have been for years (how does all that work?) must have been causing serious tremors through the evil realm- Jesus does not permit them to speak – the secrecy thing is fascinating- These were not the terms Jesus wanted his self revelation to run on- action far more important.
and the whole city was gathered around the door- polis is the word for city here- perhaps Capernaum was between a kwme (village) and a polis- in the NIV polis is translated city 86 times, town 51 and village once. Seems like a pretty big event in Capernaum- again told with a minimum of fuss- this is the town you have grown up in – you've never seen anything like this before- old bert who's been sick for 40 years has just been healed- the butcher who never shows much emotion is looking on incredulously- its all outside the door of your house. But Mark has already used amazed and astounded for the crowds reaction – don't need to dither here any more.
and he would not permit the demons to speak- because they knew him.
Must have been causing a ruckus in the spiritual realm- there's demons being turfed out in a way they mustn't have been for years (how does all that work?) must have been causing serious tremors through the evil realm- Jesus does not permit them to speak – the secrecy thing is fascinating- These were not the terms Jesus wanted his self revelation to run on- action far more important.
The kitchen table
Another euthus- and immediately- at once, as they left the synagogue they entered the house of ...
The house of Simon and Andrew, with james and john- is this something these boys had been doing most their life- growing up in the same town- over at each other's houses? There's no reminisces from the gospel writers about a typical scene in Simon and Andrews house- there was a medium sized room which we cleared out whatever was normally in the middle – or brought a table from the other room into the middle- and crowded around – dinner was always jovial- but it was afther dinner we used to really look forward to- Jesus would always thank Mildred after finishing eating for the fine meal then began to talk to us- the flickering glow of the lamp.. how different to the time 15 years early when the four of us were forced to sit there... or whatever.
There is no meal here- they've just come back from the Synagogue and Simon's mother in law sick- and Mark shows little inclination to indulge in such diversions with his events tumbling on events style. - Still there is very little of that sort of reminiscing type of thing in the gospels. Perhaps a few things- perhaps it is indulgent- a Max Lucado sort of indulgent- (not that I've read one of his books for a very long time) – indicative of our society where we all think the world revolves around us- worship songs full of I and my. Somehow this was a bigger thing than just one or four men's stories- though it doesn't seem like it would particularly be something they would have thought of putting in anyway- they are limited to John using the phrase 'the disciple whom Jesus loved' , perhaps Mark's naked running man, John's relaying a conversation Jesus had with Peter when he was following to clear up a misunderstanding about whether he was going to die or not, Matthew's use of Matthew contrasting with the other accounts use of Levi- and then the incidental things that you might expect to see in an eyewitness account- there was a lot of grass in that place- sitting down on the green grass so they looked like vegetables in a vegetable patch.
The fact that it was written as a public account though the editors and authors did exercise discretion about what they left in and out.
That it wasn't written by people kicking up their heals with the luxury of unharried remembrances- the kingdom of God had come- they were in motion, servants with jobs to do- and the writing got done in the midst of this.
Probably have to be a bit careful there- John's gospel has the feel of something that has perculated in someone's head for awhile- profound and succint usually has a fair bit behind it (In my vast experience).
Anyway- there is a sense in which it would be great to have a record of that sort of interaction between the disciples- they get together and catch up after a few years of not seeing each other- do you remember when- but another mark of authenticity – not written long enough after the event to get a 400 year legend feel that accounts of Buddha might have (do they?) and the way the disciples viewed and experienced the events precluded this as well. - all too real and everyday to make it anything else, honesty prevented it- they came to the knowledge of his divinity through living with him as a man- and it wasn't a 'from afar knowledge'. There were around three years (with some time taken out at appropriate seasons) where they lived with each other- camped out at night because they were too much of an item to camp in the towns, stayed in Bethany- stayed all over the place- travelled on the road- went on preaching tours together- When Jesus chose the 12 so that they might be with him- it was in the deepest sense- they did get to knock about with him – rub shoulders- share life- all sorts of moments; it was so they would know him (and keep on knowing him when he was 'gone' and keep on being 'with' him)- given a job and the knowledge of his person absolutely crucial to this. It is not second generation veneration.
The house of Simon and Andrew, with james and john- is this something these boys had been doing most their life- growing up in the same town- over at each other's houses? There's no reminisces from the gospel writers about a typical scene in Simon and Andrews house- there was a medium sized room which we cleared out whatever was normally in the middle – or brought a table from the other room into the middle- and crowded around – dinner was always jovial- but it was afther dinner we used to really look forward to- Jesus would always thank Mildred after finishing eating for the fine meal then began to talk to us- the flickering glow of the lamp.. how different to the time 15 years early when the four of us were forced to sit there... or whatever.
There is no meal here- they've just come back from the Synagogue and Simon's mother in law sick- and Mark shows little inclination to indulge in such diversions with his events tumbling on events style. - Still there is very little of that sort of reminiscing type of thing in the gospels. Perhaps a few things- perhaps it is indulgent- a Max Lucado sort of indulgent- (not that I've read one of his books for a very long time) – indicative of our society where we all think the world revolves around us- worship songs full of I and my. Somehow this was a bigger thing than just one or four men's stories- though it doesn't seem like it would particularly be something they would have thought of putting in anyway- they are limited to John using the phrase 'the disciple whom Jesus loved' , perhaps Mark's naked running man, John's relaying a conversation Jesus had with Peter when he was following to clear up a misunderstanding about whether he was going to die or not, Matthew's use of Matthew contrasting with the other accounts use of Levi- and then the incidental things that you might expect to see in an eyewitness account- there was a lot of grass in that place- sitting down on the green grass so they looked like vegetables in a vegetable patch.
The fact that it was written as a public account though the editors and authors did exercise discretion about what they left in and out.
That it wasn't written by people kicking up their heals with the luxury of unharried remembrances- the kingdom of God had come- they were in motion, servants with jobs to do- and the writing got done in the midst of this.
Probably have to be a bit careful there- John's gospel has the feel of something that has perculated in someone's head for awhile- profound and succint usually has a fair bit behind it (In my vast experience).
Anyway- there is a sense in which it would be great to have a record of that sort of interaction between the disciples- they get together and catch up after a few years of not seeing each other- do you remember when- but another mark of authenticity – not written long enough after the event to get a 400 year legend feel that accounts of Buddha might have (do they?) and the way the disciples viewed and experienced the events precluded this as well. - all too real and everyday to make it anything else, honesty prevented it- they came to the knowledge of his divinity through living with him as a man- and it wasn't a 'from afar knowledge'. There were around three years (with some time taken out at appropriate seasons) where they lived with each other- camped out at night because they were too much of an item to camp in the towns, stayed in Bethany- stayed all over the place- travelled on the road- went on preaching tours together- When Jesus chose the 12 so that they might be with him- it was in the deepest sense- they did get to knock about with him – rub shoulders- share life- all sorts of moments; it was so they would know him (and keep on knowing him when he was 'gone' and keep on being 'with' him)- given a job and the knowledge of his person absolutely crucial to this. It is not second generation veneration.
Demonic fear
23 starts with another euthus. There is an interesting expression the demon uses- what is there to us (= ours) and (at the same time) to you (= yours) ie, “what have we in common?” What have we to do with you? what do you want with us
I've never really thought that much about this before- here we have (in Mark at least) the first instance (apart from the temptation in the desert where Mark doesn't tell us what was said, the demonic side of things/ reaction to what Jesus is doing- And its a pretty wary stance- which seems to guess at the end game to a degree- but can't see that clearly. “What have we to do with you- what do you want with us, Jesus of Nazareth? Something like- what is he doing here? in a domain we have had free run in pretty well,- like something out of a gangster movie or a new boy in the playground who comes with a bigger reputation than the current big boy. “Have you come to destroy us? - It knows and fears the power before it- And perhaps this is a reasonable guess as far as it goes- How does the demonic realm work? What we're the whisperings in the ranks about Jesus- what were the directives from higher up?
“I know who you are, the holy one of God.” Somehow trying to upset the applecart here (don't think I've ever written that before in my life- must be a sign of being 35- as you get older you are inexorably drawn to time honoured cliches and sayings that you never would have dreamed of when you were sensible and younger). Jesus seems to be flying under the radar- we don't know why- but we know he's dangerous so we'll try and expose him, - And why this particular expression- the holy one of God? Interesting testimony from the other side- is this like a kid saying that someone else is the teachers pet? I assume the demon was once an Angel- can it remember Jesus beside the Father? Does the have you come to destroy us, show glimpses of remembered fear of being cast from heaven and the son's part in this (did he have a part? Is it Michael Archangel in Ezekiel- or somewhere else)
There must be rules of engagement- or parameters that the Fathers sustaining power allows demons and satan to operate in but not exceed- just killing Jesus at will because he has turned up is not an option – at least the timing is not- though such a desire strangely conincided with the Father's purposes- and Jesus had a very finely nuanced understanding of his 'time'.
The interplay between human and divine or spiritual is pretty hazy to me- somehow when we die we become more of both, while here we struggle to get a handle on either end of the stick. In the Solomon islands Malcolm has prayed and someone has come back to life- and there is a far greater predominance it seems of notable crossover between the realms- here the realms are just as real- but much more opaque for the majority of people- I think I miss this reality- and am suspicious of people who seem too give it to much attention- seeing the devil under every rock. I imagine there's a middle ground.
It would seem the demon has got fairly close to the money- Jesus response is swift (he couldn't stop it before it happened it seems- he still has to react in full view of everyone- not Jesus in the pope mobile smiling serenely behind bullet proof glass- and so much more masterful because of this). Two imperatives (fimwtheti and exelthe) Be quiet and exit or come out of him. Both aorist, signifying once off action. The unclean spirit convulses him (sparaxan- wonder if spastic coming from this root?) calls out with a loud cry, and comes out of him. I think this is one of the areas where hearing this story often, innoculates you to the shock value it should have. I have never actually seen something similar- and I think it would leave a fair impression if I had. What did that great/ loud cry sound like? and it comes after an exchange that probably would break most social conventions. The crowds do not seem to be particularly surprised about a man with an unclean spirit- no mention along those lines- so there's a big difference with Australia, but what leaves its mark is the manner of its leaving- ethambethesan- amazed – bdag has , to be extraordinarily impressed or disturbed by something intr- wonder, marvel, be astonished (the context determines in a good or bad sense). - it led to that hushed murmur of a crowd when something fantastic has happened and you are impelled to turn to the person next to you even if you don't know him and say , mate you don't see that every day- what do you make of it? It's not how we've heard things before- and then the actions that go along with it- I've seen plenty of people with unclean spirits but someone who commands them and they obey...
And not surprisingly, most people who were there had something to talk about in their upcoming social exchanges for the next few weeks.
Again, it is the authority that impresses them- like me trying to tell (ask) a dissenting year 8 student to pick up a paper from the floor- the lack of authority is very apparent- and the worse the kid, the more remarkable it is if he does it.
I've never really thought that much about this before- here we have (in Mark at least) the first instance (apart from the temptation in the desert where Mark doesn't tell us what was said, the demonic side of things/ reaction to what Jesus is doing- And its a pretty wary stance- which seems to guess at the end game to a degree- but can't see that clearly. “What have we to do with you- what do you want with us, Jesus of Nazareth? Something like- what is he doing here? in a domain we have had free run in pretty well,- like something out of a gangster movie or a new boy in the playground who comes with a bigger reputation than the current big boy. “Have you come to destroy us? - It knows and fears the power before it- And perhaps this is a reasonable guess as far as it goes- How does the demonic realm work? What we're the whisperings in the ranks about Jesus- what were the directives from higher up?
“I know who you are, the holy one of God.” Somehow trying to upset the applecart here (don't think I've ever written that before in my life- must be a sign of being 35- as you get older you are inexorably drawn to time honoured cliches and sayings that you never would have dreamed of when you were sensible and younger). Jesus seems to be flying under the radar- we don't know why- but we know he's dangerous so we'll try and expose him, - And why this particular expression- the holy one of God? Interesting testimony from the other side- is this like a kid saying that someone else is the teachers pet? I assume the demon was once an Angel- can it remember Jesus beside the Father? Does the have you come to destroy us, show glimpses of remembered fear of being cast from heaven and the son's part in this (did he have a part? Is it Michael Archangel in Ezekiel- or somewhere else)
There must be rules of engagement- or parameters that the Fathers sustaining power allows demons and satan to operate in but not exceed- just killing Jesus at will because he has turned up is not an option – at least the timing is not- though such a desire strangely conincided with the Father's purposes- and Jesus had a very finely nuanced understanding of his 'time'.
The interplay between human and divine or spiritual is pretty hazy to me- somehow when we die we become more of both, while here we struggle to get a handle on either end of the stick. In the Solomon islands Malcolm has prayed and someone has come back to life- and there is a far greater predominance it seems of notable crossover between the realms- here the realms are just as real- but much more opaque for the majority of people- I think I miss this reality- and am suspicious of people who seem too give it to much attention- seeing the devil under every rock. I imagine there's a middle ground.
It would seem the demon has got fairly close to the money- Jesus response is swift (he couldn't stop it before it happened it seems- he still has to react in full view of everyone- not Jesus in the pope mobile smiling serenely behind bullet proof glass- and so much more masterful because of this). Two imperatives (fimwtheti and exelthe) Be quiet and exit or come out of him. Both aorist, signifying once off action. The unclean spirit convulses him (sparaxan- wonder if spastic coming from this root?) calls out with a loud cry, and comes out of him. I think this is one of the areas where hearing this story often, innoculates you to the shock value it should have. I have never actually seen something similar- and I think it would leave a fair impression if I had. What did that great/ loud cry sound like? and it comes after an exchange that probably would break most social conventions. The crowds do not seem to be particularly surprised about a man with an unclean spirit- no mention along those lines- so there's a big difference with Australia, but what leaves its mark is the manner of its leaving- ethambethesan- amazed – bdag has , to be extraordinarily impressed or disturbed by something intr- wonder, marvel, be astonished (the context determines in a good or bad sense). - it led to that hushed murmur of a crowd when something fantastic has happened and you are impelled to turn to the person next to you even if you don't know him and say , mate you don't see that every day- what do you make of it? It's not how we've heard things before- and then the actions that go along with it- I've seen plenty of people with unclean spirits but someone who commands them and they obey...
And not surprisingly, most people who were there had something to talk about in their upcoming social exchanges for the next few weeks.
Again, it is the authority that impresses them- like me trying to tell (ask) a dissenting year 8 student to pick up a paper from the floor- the lack of authority is very apparent- and the worse the kid, the more remarkable it is if he does it.
Noteworthy authority
When Jesus goes to Capernaum he heads for the synagogue- he had something to say- a message to be received (or at least made known) by the Jews. The Jews there have a very definite reaction- ex e plairsonto- from the verb ekplairsw- strike with panic; astound; passive (which it is here) be struck with amazement, be overwhelmed with astonishment. - in other words nothing like when the venerated old rabbi comes to town and people respectfully listen and perhaps gain something from – or are impressed with his lore. This is more like a dip in a very cold river- doesn't feel like a gradual warming to the speaker type of situation. - for he was teaching them as one having authority and not as the scribes. Interesting out of all the possible things that they could have been astounded about- it was his authority that was picked out- here was teaching that was immediately distinguished from what they were used to – and it was the mark of authority that was responsible. We are not even told in Mark here what Jesus was saying- the point in Mark's head that seems to be important, is the way in which it was said- and the reaction this had on the people and demons listening.
Thursday, October 8, 2009
Productive time
They go to Capernaum- seems to be where Jesus base is for a lot of his ministry years. Writing that it strikes me once again that Jesus only had about three of these. By far the biggest portion of his adult life was spent as a tekton- one who constructs, builder, carpenter- less frequent use – worker in stone (BDAG). On the whole most of his life is spent as a 'normal' human being- or Jew in Galilee- and we know next to nothing about it- except what we can infer from the man we see in the gospels- and what must have he spent time in before this time to become this (a thoroughgoing knowledge of the scriptures, a propensity to go away to lonely places and spend time with the father). Also the boy at 12 from Lukes account.
Just read this from Theilicke
A person who is only a path through which the daily trafffic passes, who is no more than a busy street where people go rushing by hour after hour and where there is never a moment of rest, will hardly provide soil in which the eternal seed can grow. People who are always on the go are the most in danger.
A person who can no longer be recepive 'soil' for ar least '15' minutes each day, who never allows himself to be “plowed” and opened up, never waits for what God drops into his furrow, that person has actually already lost the game at the crucial point. The rich and the great people of this world, whose names everybody knows, because they are always out where the traffic is thick, are often very poor people. It is dangerously easy for them to think they are something great when the rushing, heavy traffic keeps constantly passing over them, And yet they are infinitely poorer than a poor, nameless furrow where fruit is springing up.
Just read this from Theilicke
A person who is only a path through which the daily trafffic passes, who is no more than a busy street where people go rushing by hour after hour and where there is never a moment of rest, will hardly provide soil in which the eternal seed can grow. People who are always on the go are the most in danger.
A person who can no longer be recepive 'soil' for ar least '15' minutes each day, who never allows himself to be “plowed” and opened up, never waits for what God drops into his furrow, that person has actually already lost the game at the crucial point. The rich and the great people of this world, whose names everybody knows, because they are always out where the traffic is thick, are often very poor people. It is dangerously easy for them to think they are something great when the rushing, heavy traffic keeps constantly passing over them, And yet they are infinitely poorer than a poor, nameless furrow where fruit is springing up.
Wednesday, September 9, 2009
Calling and fishing
Mark doesn't let any back story get in the way here- Jesus is strolling along (probably more purposeful) the lake and sees Simon and Andrew about their work and gives them the option of a career change.
and Jesus said to them, Deute opisw mou, kai poisw umas genesthai halieis anthropwn
Come after me and I will make you to become (aorist infinitive) fishers of men. Wonder how much significance that has- I will make you to become fishers of men- aorist inf. meaning its a once of becoming when it happens- so once Jesus has made them to become fishers of men – this is what they will remain. I want to be one of those- and continue to be that.
...kai euthus they left their nets and followed him. Things do happen pretty quickly in Mark- so you don't get some of the background provided by John which shows that these men already knew Jesus- nor the story in Luke where Peter is fishing and Jesus tells him to go out again- and he replies Go away from me, Lord, I am a sinful man! Then Jesus said to Simon, Don't be afraid; from now on you will catch men.” So they pullled their boats up on the shore, left everything and followed him.
There is a sense where Mark's brevity is almost a little dishonest. - Jesus walks along the lake – sees these fishermen, calls them and they follow, but more like- Jesus had already had dealings with these men- then on this day sees them out fishing tells them to go back out- they do, though not without telling him in won't do any good- they were professionals- they knew how these things work- but there was respect from them towards this Nazarean teacher/ man- then they are met face up with a miracle (as fishermen they should know) and here Peter responds – go away- too good for me- and Jesus makes him an offer he can't refuse.
Still perhaps is Mark it brings the result into stark relief? (can I say that). Immediately they left their nets and followed him- they left everything- livelihood (and claims on a normal family life) and followed...
We've got a house now- (and a bed we can't sleep on- but good quality) two cars at the moment, a dream of travelling around different parts of the world next year...
How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of heaven- easier for a camel to enter through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven...
Didn't work for the house- gift.
Have to hold these things lightly and rightly.
Jesus I want to follow you.
and Jesus said to them, Deute opisw mou, kai poisw umas genesthai halieis anthropwn
Come after me and I will make you to become (aorist infinitive) fishers of men. Wonder how much significance that has- I will make you to become fishers of men- aorist inf. meaning its a once of becoming when it happens- so once Jesus has made them to become fishers of men – this is what they will remain. I want to be one of those- and continue to be that.
...kai euthus they left their nets and followed him. Things do happen pretty quickly in Mark- so you don't get some of the background provided by John which shows that these men already knew Jesus- nor the story in Luke where Peter is fishing and Jesus tells him to go out again- and he replies Go away from me, Lord, I am a sinful man! Then Jesus said to Simon, Don't be afraid; from now on you will catch men.” So they pullled their boats up on the shore, left everything and followed him.
There is a sense where Mark's brevity is almost a little dishonest. - Jesus walks along the lake – sees these fishermen, calls them and they follow, but more like- Jesus had already had dealings with these men- then on this day sees them out fishing tells them to go back out- they do, though not without telling him in won't do any good- they were professionals- they knew how these things work- but there was respect from them towards this Nazarean teacher/ man- then they are met face up with a miracle (as fishermen they should know) and here Peter responds – go away- too good for me- and Jesus makes him an offer he can't refuse.
Still perhaps is Mark it brings the result into stark relief? (can I say that). Immediately they left their nets and followed him- they left everything- livelihood (and claims on a normal family life) and followed...
We've got a house now- (and a bed we can't sleep on- but good quality) two cars at the moment, a dream of travelling around different parts of the world next year...
How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of heaven- easier for a camel to enter through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven...
Didn't work for the house- gift.
Have to hold these things lightly and rightly.
Jesus I want to follow you.
Sunday, August 2, 2009
little heading spit
Mark 1:16
I think the fact that we have little headings in our bible can break it up a tiny bit- Its almost like in Mark they give us little pauses- when it doesn't really seem like this was his intention. v16 perhaps an example- The NRSV and NIV both have As Jesus ... passed along the Sea of Galilee /walked beside the sea of Galilee – whereas the greek has the participle paragwn- and passing by ... then the verb eiden he was seeing – he saw. So the word 'Jesus' is not there- it obviously is Jesus- (and this may be nothing) but it seems at Mark's pace and also the way he's 'telling' the story, this is not needed. In some ways having the heading Jesus calls the first Disciples is a bit annoying. Mark is doing an excellent job of telling a rollicking (French's word I think) story- and he's being over edited. I think it can have unfortunate effects – a bit like at the Salvo's where simplistic messages are often given. Like the back cover of Peter Renner's book
“If men and women today began by the thousands experiencing the depths of Jesus Christ in a transforming way there would simply be no place for their expression of experience to fit into present-day straightjackets of Christianity. Protestant or Catholic, neither one is structured to contain a mass of devoted people who long for spiritual depth. We are structured towards infancy. (Gordon Cosby).
In some ways a little heading is overly directive- and I think what it can do as we read, is for us to sum up what the passage is about before we have actually read it. It can put a slant in there about what the main point is- whereas if we were just reading the work- we would have to come up with the main points ourselves- and be more in the hands of where the author was leading us. I think the problem is mostly we know the outline of the story- in many ways in churches we've been hearing it simplistically explained for years, I grew up with it- you can think you know the story- see the little heading- oh this is that part, and then the mind actually shuts down.
And often the way we've been directed to 'read' the story may not actually be a very good interpretation- it's somehow been put through the processes of this big teaching institution- gone through the editorial department, the pedagogical department, the dogmatic department and we can end up with something less than the story. Of course its not all faceless suits – we read in ways that can take away from the story ourselves- bring our own presuppositions to the texts- but worldview is very powerful and I think usually not really thought through. The default settings are what we often revert to.
Something that relates and it's written by Helmut so I have to include it,
But as we said, hermeneutics is so fascinating and a student can so delight in his precosity that he goes on putting it in first place- and then, frequently enough gets stuck there, never pushing on to the laborious task of boring into the hard wood of the text and gaining material knowledge. We often discover this in our examinations. There it not infrequently happens that a student is able to explain to his examiners very precisely and fluently how the New Testament is to be understood – if one were to read it! But often this has not been done...
Helmut Thielicke 1967 Between Heaven and Earth p56, James Clarke and Co, London
I think the fact that we have little headings in our bible can break it up a tiny bit- Its almost like in Mark they give us little pauses- when it doesn't really seem like this was his intention. v16 perhaps an example- The NRSV and NIV both have As Jesus ... passed along the Sea of Galilee /walked beside the sea of Galilee – whereas the greek has the participle paragwn- and passing by ... then the verb eiden he was seeing – he saw. So the word 'Jesus' is not there- it obviously is Jesus- (and this may be nothing) but it seems at Mark's pace and also the way he's 'telling' the story, this is not needed. In some ways having the heading Jesus calls the first Disciples is a bit annoying. Mark is doing an excellent job of telling a rollicking (French's word I think) story- and he's being over edited. I think it can have unfortunate effects – a bit like at the Salvo's where simplistic messages are often given. Like the back cover of Peter Renner's book
“If men and women today began by the thousands experiencing the depths of Jesus Christ in a transforming way there would simply be no place for their expression of experience to fit into present-day straightjackets of Christianity. Protestant or Catholic, neither one is structured to contain a mass of devoted people who long for spiritual depth. We are structured towards infancy. (Gordon Cosby).
In some ways a little heading is overly directive- and I think what it can do as we read, is for us to sum up what the passage is about before we have actually read it. It can put a slant in there about what the main point is- whereas if we were just reading the work- we would have to come up with the main points ourselves- and be more in the hands of where the author was leading us. I think the problem is mostly we know the outline of the story- in many ways in churches we've been hearing it simplistically explained for years, I grew up with it- you can think you know the story- see the little heading- oh this is that part, and then the mind actually shuts down.
And often the way we've been directed to 'read' the story may not actually be a very good interpretation- it's somehow been put through the processes of this big teaching institution- gone through the editorial department, the pedagogical department, the dogmatic department and we can end up with something less than the story. Of course its not all faceless suits – we read in ways that can take away from the story ourselves- bring our own presuppositions to the texts- but worldview is very powerful and I think usually not really thought through. The default settings are what we often revert to.
Something that relates and it's written by Helmut so I have to include it,
But as we said, hermeneutics is so fascinating and a student can so delight in his precosity that he goes on putting it in first place- and then, frequently enough gets stuck there, never pushing on to the laborious task of boring into the hard wood of the text and gaining material knowledge. We often discover this in our examinations. There it not infrequently happens that a student is able to explain to his examiners very precisely and fluently how the New Testament is to be understood – if one were to read it! But often this has not been done...
Helmut Thielicke 1967 Between Heaven and Earth p56, James Clarke and Co, London
Friday, July 31, 2009
The oportune time
After John had been (handed over) – arrested (paradothenai) I wonder why the NIV says put in prison- its not in the text- The NRSV has, 'Now after John was arrested...'
We get a brief interesting cameo from John and he's put away- Jesus is back from the desert with a far catchier message than Obama- he proclaims (kerusswn) the good news of God (Mark obviously attaches great significance to it) oti Peplerwtai o kairos kai engiken e basilea tou theou- that the time has been fulfilled, has been completed and the kingdom of God be at hand- practically, has come, is here.
fulifilled- perfect passive -Perfective: accomplished action (where the present state resulting from, and/or present consequence of, a prior action are being stressed; the meaning of the perfect is I am in the position of having done). from Ward Powers
That seems to fit nicely- all of it – time has been heading towards this- events have been heading towards this (the word for time is the broader kairos rather than chronos- chronos usually used in a stricter sense, whereas kairos- time, season, opportunity) there are lots of prior actions that precede this- but the present state and present consequence are of the utmost importance- if the time has been fulfilled then it follows that the kingdom of God is at hand and men would be wise to respond- goes a little further than John- repent (imperative) and believe (imperative) in the good news.
We get a brief interesting cameo from John and he's put away- Jesus is back from the desert with a far catchier message than Obama- he proclaims (kerusswn) the good news of God (Mark obviously attaches great significance to it) oti Peplerwtai o kairos kai engiken e basilea tou theou- that the time has been fulfilled, has been completed and the kingdom of God be at hand- practically, has come, is here.
fulifilled- perfect passive -Perfective: accomplished action (where the present state resulting from, and/or present consequence of, a prior action are being stressed; the meaning of the perfect is I am in the position of having done). from Ward Powers
That seems to fit nicely- all of it – time has been heading towards this- events have been heading towards this (the word for time is the broader kairos rather than chronos- chronos usually used in a stricter sense, whereas kairos- time, season, opportunity) there are lots of prior actions that precede this- but the present state and present consequence are of the utmost importance- if the time has been fulfilled then it follows that the kingdom of God is at hand and men would be wise to respond- goes a little further than John- repent (imperative) and believe (imperative) in the good news.
Thursday, July 30, 2009
Mark 1: 1- 11ish
Mark
Chapter 1 Arkhe tou euangeliou Iesou Xristou {viou Theou] Just as it has been written in the prophet Isaiah, behold I send my messenger before your face... Into it- definitely a hallmark of this work- doesn't muck around- same sort of principle as an action movie- except definitely a plot here, and a strong lead character who I think Mark is inviting us to come up with our own character analysis for- as well as 'wanting to tilt the world in a certain direction. Classic start- Beginning of the good news of Jesus Christ (I'll have to read French about the lack of the article there. Interesting that he then follows that up with a quote from the prophet Isaiah- this beginning has a pre history- and some of it is known for the Jews. look at Isaiah.
John feels like a good 'before your face' fit- he's out it in the desert places (eremo). 'a voice- a voice which is not saying what the religious leaders of the day are saying- at least not in the same way- a voice not coming from the city but outside- is that an allusion to Moses and the burning bush?
What is the significance of a voice of one calling (a herald) in the desert? ... It's starker- there's not a backdrop of other things going on- There's a whole lot of previous 'desert experience' for the Jews- The exodus- Most of Moses 'ministry'...
Prepare the way for the Lord, make straight paths for him.
So what are you thinking if you have not heard this story before?
Here's the good news- ( how was this used in the ancient world?) Jesus Christ is the man- we go back to an old oracle that somehow relates- and John is the fulfilment of the forerunner part- the support act for the main show. Yep – an intriguing start- then you have this character baptising (again – non jews understanding?) repentance and forgiveness of sins- interesting concepts at the start of a book- everyone's going out into the desert- bit of a pilgramage thing- is that what you'd be thinking? And he's wearing a camel cloak with a leather belt- eating grasshoppers and wild honey.
What a great start- and in not very many words- indeed it would be great to know more about this eccentric desert seer but the description is very economical- that ring of truth the gospel writers have. And his message- (mate you think I'm interesting – you haven't seen anything- but of course this isn't it at all- John carries off his intrigue and oddness in a self effacing way) After me will come one more powerful than I whose sandals I am not worthy to stoop down and untie, I baptise you with water, but he will baptise you with the holy spirit.
This start keeps getting better- What a great statement of intrigue- after him a powerful man of glory who is going to baptise (whatever this is) people with the holy spirit.
Even if you've got no or little idea of what's going on there's much to pique curiousity.
And so John came- he is the fit for the words.
How would you prepare the way for the lord and make straight paths for him?
by repenting from sins and being forgiven for them- make straight the path into you heart.
(v9) And it came to pass (coming from a Hebrew construction) at that time Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee.. and was baptised by John in the Jordan.
So we get the forerunner and the main man together (pretty quick)
(10) and immediately as Jesus was coming up out of the water... The first euthus- bit of a classic- the narrative pace is already fast- but its too slow for Mark- we need some suddenly's – and lots of them- don't care what my English teacher told me.
Probably very appropriate- things are just appearing in the story- back story is either very brief or non existent- things are happening 'suddenly'.
Again- momentous events being described with the minimum of fuss- how much did those around observe about this incident? - John 'testifies' in John's gospel that he saw this and that alerted him to the fact that this was the one who would baptise with the holy spirit (J 1:32ff) He had been told by the one that sent him to baptise with water- I assume the Father.
Mark has Jesus seeing heaven being torn open (skhizomenous) and the spirit descending like (hws) a dove – and John obviously saw it as well- and then the voice... So if you reading this with little idea- you've got some sort of transaction happening the 'gods' or heaven or the supernatural- and a voice out of heaven saying- (heaven in the plural in Greek- but I think this may be just how the do heaven- not sure if it matters either way) You are my son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased- so we have a divinely favoured man- and all in very quick time. The Father doesn't say much directly in the gospels- what he does then- seems to be somewhat significant- Jesus is his man- completely adequate to do his job and show Israel the father- so there is little need for him to talk- but when he does – its affirmation- and a happy reality- you are my son (this defines Jesus- it is also his constant reference point (comes through very strongly in John)) whom I love- with you I am well pleased- That's a good Father- what could you possibly say that was better to a son?
The spirit has descended (how much of a revolution for the Jews was the clearer picture that emerges of the Spirit? - exactly what was the picture at this time?) and euthus sends him out into the desert.
Why?
Right at the start- toughening up for the major task ahead- like being sent to Ballarat for five years.
Is there any links here with the scapegoat that got sent to wander in the desert with the sins of the people having been placed on it- or is that on the cross totally.
40 days in the desert (surely an allusion to Israels 40 years in the desert- Tommo thinks Jesus often reenacting the story of Israel I think...) being tempted by Satan- but here the result is different.
He was with the wild animals and angels attended him.
Every so often- perhaps not very often at all- but getting very away on your own – probably important. In this particular case Jesus was sent- he was wanted there- perhaps the Hebrews thing- being perfected by suffering- the adage that God wants us to grow – he loves us , desires the best for us, therefore will not make things easy- supremely so in the case of Jesus. At the end of the process Jesus is totally worthy – there is no wincing in Revelation with the throngs around the throne- no dissonance (actually he wasn't quite as good as that... but I'll go along with this pretence because of the occasion) no wishful eulogies. Help me to stand in the face of temptation and trial.
Interesting how this was relayed. It would have been known that he was off in the wilderness by at least a few I imagine- there would have been a crowd (how many?) where John was baptising- wherever he was staying at the time (and they were far more communal than us) he wouldn't have been home for over a month- I wonder where he came back to? he would have been very hungry and in need of recuperation. What does it mean when it says the angels attended him?
If Andrew was one of John's disciples and witnessed him going off – or knew of it- did he ask Jesus about it at some stage? I wonder how Jesus described the time to the disciples ?And what are they thinking when he tells them about being tempted by Satan? What is their idea of Satan?
I wonder what his friendships were like with the disciples- I suppose different for each man to a degree- I imagine moments of great warmth and shared humanity- and some times where was a definite distinction- leadership can do that a bit- but that is probably heightened if you walk on water in front of people.
This must have happened some time previously to the time in John where John is saying behold the lamb of God... and Jesus says come and see.
Chapter 1 Arkhe tou euangeliou Iesou Xristou {viou Theou] Just as it has been written in the prophet Isaiah, behold I send my messenger before your face... Into it- definitely a hallmark of this work- doesn't muck around- same sort of principle as an action movie- except definitely a plot here, and a strong lead character who I think Mark is inviting us to come up with our own character analysis for- as well as 'wanting to tilt the world in a certain direction. Classic start- Beginning of the good news of Jesus Christ (I'll have to read French about the lack of the article there. Interesting that he then follows that up with a quote from the prophet Isaiah- this beginning has a pre history- and some of it is known for the Jews. look at Isaiah.
John feels like a good 'before your face' fit- he's out it in the desert places (eremo). 'a voice- a voice which is not saying what the religious leaders of the day are saying- at least not in the same way- a voice not coming from the city but outside- is that an allusion to Moses and the burning bush?
What is the significance of a voice of one calling (a herald) in the desert? ... It's starker- there's not a backdrop of other things going on- There's a whole lot of previous 'desert experience' for the Jews- The exodus- Most of Moses 'ministry'...
Prepare the way for the Lord, make straight paths for him.
So what are you thinking if you have not heard this story before?
Here's the good news- ( how was this used in the ancient world?) Jesus Christ is the man- we go back to an old oracle that somehow relates- and John is the fulfilment of the forerunner part- the support act for the main show. Yep – an intriguing start- then you have this character baptising (again – non jews understanding?) repentance and forgiveness of sins- interesting concepts at the start of a book- everyone's going out into the desert- bit of a pilgramage thing- is that what you'd be thinking? And he's wearing a camel cloak with a leather belt- eating grasshoppers and wild honey.
What a great start- and in not very many words- indeed it would be great to know more about this eccentric desert seer but the description is very economical- that ring of truth the gospel writers have. And his message- (mate you think I'm interesting – you haven't seen anything- but of course this isn't it at all- John carries off his intrigue and oddness in a self effacing way) After me will come one more powerful than I whose sandals I am not worthy to stoop down and untie, I baptise you with water, but he will baptise you with the holy spirit.
This start keeps getting better- What a great statement of intrigue- after him a powerful man of glory who is going to baptise (whatever this is) people with the holy spirit.
Even if you've got no or little idea of what's going on there's much to pique curiousity.
And so John came- he is the fit for the words.
How would you prepare the way for the lord and make straight paths for him?
by repenting from sins and being forgiven for them- make straight the path into you heart.
(v9) And it came to pass (coming from a Hebrew construction) at that time Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee.. and was baptised by John in the Jordan.
So we get the forerunner and the main man together (pretty quick)
(10) and immediately as Jesus was coming up out of the water... The first euthus- bit of a classic- the narrative pace is already fast- but its too slow for Mark- we need some suddenly's – and lots of them- don't care what my English teacher told me.
Probably very appropriate- things are just appearing in the story- back story is either very brief or non existent- things are happening 'suddenly'.
Again- momentous events being described with the minimum of fuss- how much did those around observe about this incident? - John 'testifies' in John's gospel that he saw this and that alerted him to the fact that this was the one who would baptise with the holy spirit (J 1:32ff) He had been told by the one that sent him to baptise with water- I assume the Father.
Mark has Jesus seeing heaven being torn open (skhizomenous) and the spirit descending like (hws) a dove – and John obviously saw it as well- and then the voice... So if you reading this with little idea- you've got some sort of transaction happening the 'gods' or heaven or the supernatural- and a voice out of heaven saying- (heaven in the plural in Greek- but I think this may be just how the do heaven- not sure if it matters either way) You are my son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased- so we have a divinely favoured man- and all in very quick time. The Father doesn't say much directly in the gospels- what he does then- seems to be somewhat significant- Jesus is his man- completely adequate to do his job and show Israel the father- so there is little need for him to talk- but when he does – its affirmation- and a happy reality- you are my son (this defines Jesus- it is also his constant reference point (comes through very strongly in John)) whom I love- with you I am well pleased- That's a good Father- what could you possibly say that was better to a son?
The spirit has descended (how much of a revolution for the Jews was the clearer picture that emerges of the Spirit? - exactly what was the picture at this time?) and euthus sends him out into the desert.
Why?
Right at the start- toughening up for the major task ahead- like being sent to Ballarat for five years.
Is there any links here with the scapegoat that got sent to wander in the desert with the sins of the people having been placed on it- or is that on the cross totally.
40 days in the desert (surely an allusion to Israels 40 years in the desert- Tommo thinks Jesus often reenacting the story of Israel I think...) being tempted by Satan- but here the result is different.
He was with the wild animals and angels attended him.
Every so often- perhaps not very often at all- but getting very away on your own – probably important. In this particular case Jesus was sent- he was wanted there- perhaps the Hebrews thing- being perfected by suffering- the adage that God wants us to grow – he loves us , desires the best for us, therefore will not make things easy- supremely so in the case of Jesus. At the end of the process Jesus is totally worthy – there is no wincing in Revelation with the throngs around the throne- no dissonance (actually he wasn't quite as good as that... but I'll go along with this pretence because of the occasion) no wishful eulogies. Help me to stand in the face of temptation and trial.
Interesting how this was relayed. It would have been known that he was off in the wilderness by at least a few I imagine- there would have been a crowd (how many?) where John was baptising- wherever he was staying at the time (and they were far more communal than us) he wouldn't have been home for over a month- I wonder where he came back to? he would have been very hungry and in need of recuperation. What does it mean when it says the angels attended him?
If Andrew was one of John's disciples and witnessed him going off – or knew of it- did he ask Jesus about it at some stage? I wonder how Jesus described the time to the disciples ?And what are they thinking when he tells them about being tempted by Satan? What is their idea of Satan?
I wonder what his friendships were like with the disciples- I suppose different for each man to a degree- I imagine moments of great warmth and shared humanity- and some times where was a definite distinction- leadership can do that a bit- but that is probably heightened if you walk on water in front of people.
This must have happened some time previously to the time in John where John is saying behold the lamb of God... and Jesus says come and see.
For the restoration of family pride
After our elders feeble attempts at blogging I am bringing my vast knowledge of all things technical to try and remedy the situation. I expect Aaliyah, Levi and Miciah will soon be outgunning all of us with the frequency and depths of their comments. I imagine that ma or pa will not contribute much- though of course I hope for improvement however unlikely.
If it does go the way of the last blog- we should have a merry time of it Kyle.
My time is almost up at Toronto library- but my basic idea is that I've got a bit of time to be summarising books of the bible at the moment and thought I could put these profound thoughts and questions onto a blog so that others could read them and comment- disagree, agree, put their own thoughts. Could end up with a sort of community commentary.
Mawson
If it does go the way of the last blog- we should have a merry time of it Kyle.
My time is almost up at Toronto library- but my basic idea is that I've got a bit of time to be summarising books of the bible at the moment and thought I could put these profound thoughts and questions onto a blog so that others could read them and comment- disagree, agree, put their own thoughts. Could end up with a sort of community commentary.
Mawson
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)